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    The Great Debate
    Posted by LordXyrtex on Oct 04, 2004 at 11:58 AM

    Comments

    MetalKing's Avatar .
    MetalKing spoke on Oct 04, 2004 at 12:54 PM
    I agree that both sides gave good answers, but Kerry is a better public speaker. That doesn't mean he is a better leader though. Hitler was a greak speaker too and we all know how great he was (just had to start that flame).
    squee's Avatar .
    squee spoke on Oct 04, 2004 at 03:18 PM
    Quite aside from the delivery of lines, I thought the content of Kerry's answers was better as well. Bush had less to say and repeated himself too much to be compelling or convincing. Kerry gave answers based more on issues than distraction. Bush said "Its hard work" eleven times. Its flippant, not very informative and a good way of saying something without saying anything. It gives me the impression that he doesn't have much real accomplishment to talk about. His other big line, about how troops can't stand by a leader who criticizes the way the war was led, was also pretty bad. Even if he'd delivered that line well and not sounded like a whiny crybaby, its meaning simply was not effective. It was weird for him to make a big deal out of it. Kerry and his meanings were understandable and relevant, and he made me trust his judgement better. Bush seems to emotionally weak to make good decisions when they are tough.
    I'll be more interested in watching the veeps debate tomorrow. The winner won't be so predetermined. The presidential debates almost don't seem very valuable because the 2 candidates simply aren't in the same league. However Edwards, as the ambulance-chasing personal-injury lawyer, and Cheney are pretty equally matched in speaking abilities. It should be entertaining.
    holyjuan's Avatar .
    holyjuan spoke on Oct 04, 2004 at 03:27 PM
    "ambulance-chasing personal-injury lawyer"

    Squee, that gave me a good chuckle. I needed that.
    LordXyrtex's Avatar .
    LordXyrtex spoke on Oct 04, 2004 at 11:28 PM
    The VP debates should be interesting. But as stated in the forums, I'm not sure that Cheney can beat Edwards. I mean, it should definitely be a lot closer, but I think at the end of the night, Edwards will have won. How do I know?

    I think Cheney will have a heart attack in the middle of the debates!

    Sorry, I'm a huge Bush supporter but I really don't like Cheney. I never have. I don't hate him, but I just don't like him. He reminds me of that old guy that yells at little kids to get off his lawn. Its just his look, I suppose.

    Edwards has his own faults (ie ambulance-chaser, complete lack of a CNS).

    It should be fun to watch though.
    Reverend Jynxed's Avatar .
    Reverend Jynxed spoke on Oct 05, 2004 at 09:36 PM
    If by better speaker you mean constantly contradicting himself while not contradicting about a contradiction that he claims never took place contradicting yet another contradiction then yes, perhaps you are right. He is a great speaker.

    In all seriousness, he may speak well but he doesn't think 2 seconds ahead to at least know when to STFU before he slips up and claims something never took place when it did. I don't think I've ever seen a more wishy-washy candidate. Sure Bush has issues but at least he isn't contradicting himself while trying to balance on the fence to keep both sides happy at each different speaking engagement. Kerry keeps forgetting which party he is speaking to at any given time ;)
    MajicWalrus's Avatar .
    MajicWalrus spoke on Oct 05, 2004 at 10:49 PM
    I hear alot of people say this but the number of people who can prove it are significantly less.
    LordXyrtex's Avatar .
    LordXyrtex spoke on Oct 06, 2004 at 07:05 AM
    Cheney 0wnz3d.
    MajicWalrus's Avatar .
    MajicWalrus spoke on Oct 06, 2004 at 07:29 AM
    0wnz3d is such a strong semi-word.
    MetalKing's Avatar .
    MetalKing spoke on Oct 06, 2004 at 11:05 AM
    I agree with you 100%, I was only refering to the smoothness of his speaking. Most of the stuff he said was complete shit. Part of Bush's problem was he had to fight the urge to kill Kerry every time he spewed out more lies. My concern is a bunch of morons who saw that said to themselve "well kerry sounded better, who cares what he actually said, he must be a better leader"
    squee's Avatar .
    squee spoke on Oct 06, 2004 at 06:23 PM
    Ok, veep debates I'll concede as a draw. Honestly I think edwards won but I can recognize that is because I agree with his stances and not with Cheneys. But wtf is with the republican tickets' incessant bemoaning about how the Kerry/Edwards criticism denigrates our allies contributions? That asshole, Cheney's transparent effort to make the American casualties seem like only 50% instead of the real 90% denigrates our own troops' contribution. Fuckwad. Who's denigrating now? How dare they take such offense and then turn around and trivialize the load our military has dutifully shouldered? His worst line was about Dean and al queda, which doesn't have anything to do with the price of tea in china but which everyone on their side thought was some great witty line.
    Cheney looked pretty tired and worn out towards the second half of the debate. He doesn't look like he can really handle a huge load of responsibility. But as for the democrats so far, I don't see why they haven't put the republicans in their place on this flip-flopping argument yet. It wouldn't be very hard and they just haven't done it, are they waiting for a more climactic moment to shut them down or what?
    LordXyrtex's Avatar .
    LordXyrtex spoke on Oct 06, 2004 at 06:30 PM
    They can't, because between the both of them, there's more flip-flops than a gymnastics competition. Most people seem to agree Cheney won the debate, by varying degrees of course. Edwards just wasn't nearly as quick as the old man.
    Reverend Jynxed's Avatar .
    Reverend Jynxed spoke on Oct 06, 2004 at 07:27 PM
    Pick up transcripts of his speaking engagements and you'll see it for yourself... if you allow yourself too...
    MajicWalrus's Avatar .
    MajicWalrus spoke on Oct 06, 2004 at 09:08 PM
    There aren't flip-flops that are any more apparent than the at least 10 I can show you Bush has performed.
    MajicWalrus's Avatar .
    MajicWalrus spoke on Oct 06, 2004 at 09:13 PM
    I think they're waiting for them to say something that will get them utterly crushed, they'd just look stupid now and then drop it. Let it go on until you just can't anymore.
    's Avatar .
    Anonymous Coward spoke on Oct 07, 2004 at 09:34 AM
    Yeah sure.
    squee's Avatar .
    squee spoke on Oct 07, 2004 at 10:50 AM
    Like their flip-flopping about connections between Iraq and al queda. Cheney did that even in the debate, at one point going on about a long relationship between saddam and al queda, then having to say that Iraq just has a track record of terror in general.
    MajicWalrus's Avatar .
    MajicWalrus spoke on Oct 08, 2004 at 02:54 PM
    Yeah it seems that's a major descrepancy in their policy. Sometimes Iraq was just being bad, sometimes they were giving money to al queda.. Etcetera.

    I think that doesn't come from chaging your mind though, I think that comes from not knowing what they're talking about.
    LordXyrtex's Avatar .
    LordXyrtex spoke on Oct 09, 2004 at 01:33 AM
    It is so easy to preach to the choir.
    's Avatar .
    Anonymous Coward spoke on Oct 09, 2004 at 11:30 AM
    It's so easy to ignore the preacher.
    MajicWalrus's Avatar .
    MajicWalrus spoke on Oct 09, 2004 at 11:33 AM
    That was me.

    -MW
    LordXyrtex's Avatar .
    LordXyrtex spoke on Oct 09, 2004 at 12:09 PM
    You do know that I was referring to you preaching to the choir, right?

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