Only when on their periods.

Of course the geneva covention would have a fit with the cruel andunusual tactics used by said females.

Fuck it. Let em fight if they want to. Don't whine when raped and abused for years on end as someone's fucktoy.

Could always go back to the spy days of cyanide pill issuance. Take if if you are going ot be captured to avoid having your LIVE body raped.

I think women are underestimated in terms of being able to physically handle military training and even live combat, sure they have a greater chance at being injured but that does not mean that they will always get injured and can still contribute to the force.

Women can also have an advantage in the battlefield due to such stereotypes about them. Any compassionate male soldier would think twice before killing a woman because.. well.. they are women! So that gives the woman a chance to shoot first.

Men and women can be equal - they just play different roles in life..

Fuck it. Let em fight if they want to. Don't whine when raped and abused for years on end as someone's fucktoy.

That's bad, even for you Rev.

Key word is compassionate.

Aside from the United States military and a few others around the world, what military do you consider compasionate? Were the Iraqi soldiers compassionate?

Also I am compassionate and would put a bullet through an enemy woman's head rather than have her taken prisonet and fucked in every hole a sldier could find and few other that would have to be added.

There are many levels of compassion. I I was on a squad with a woman and I saw her being carted off and I was about to die, I'd sure as hell put a shot in her just to keep her from being violated.

They could just flash their boobies at the opposing army, like in that episode of Friends...

Why? You'd just be giving them another hole...

OK, I'm done with this thread.

I was being sarcastic Burn, at least on that point. There are many arguments that could be made for and against them being in the military. Being a fucktoy for years weighs against, and tips the scales severly to the side of against.

Women can't even handle being told they are wrong. They go into all kinds of emotional modes. How the hell do they handle battlefield stress? Sure some have nerves of steel but unless the enemy is yelling clean them pots biatch, I don't think they would take it very well.

Why shoot them? To avoid them having to deal with the emotional trauma associated with being a fucktoy for dirty soldiers who would rape you night and day just for the fun of it.

If I'm going to be raped, I'd rather it was my dead body that was violated.

"I I was on a squad with a woman and I saw her being carted off and I was about to die, I'd sure as hell put a shot in her just to keep her from being violated."

You cannot make life and death decisions for someone else based on your assumtions on what COULD happen to them. Thats like saying they should have killed Jessica Lynch when she was captured during or after the ambush just in case they decided to rape her. Rape is bad, but it is worth the price of life... and revenge.

If I am in a position to make that decision you can bet I CAN make it. Whether it is right or wrong is entirely another matter.

Revenge has nothing to do with it. Would you like to live with the fact that you could have stopped a woman from being raped brutally for however long knowing you COULD HAVE KEPT IT FROM HAPPENING?

In Lynch's case I would have put a bullet in her. It would have saved the rest of the world as well the troubles they went hrough thinking of a poor little girl being ass-fucked 24x7 while we could do nothing about it.

We wouldn't have to deal with any tv-movies or book deals either.

You would rather take her life so that YOU would feel better because you eliminated the risk that she could get raped?! Thats just selfish.

Hey if she is raped and didn't like living anymore - then go and kill her. Not before.

You'd have been a hero!

About the bullet thing, I know what you meant, just wanted to make that poor joke.

While my military experience was limited to 10 years in the Army Reserves, I was always in combat support units that did have females... and I don't think they should be allowed a combat role.

I can't provide one overwhelming reason, but rather a combination of factors. Before I explain, let me get this out of the way- Yes, there are some women out there who could physically, mentally and socially handle a combat role. I'm not saying the following about ALL women in the military but rather making generalizations based on my limited experience:

Women tend to be smaller, weaker and have less endurance than men. The PT (physical training) evaluations reflect this- the standards are MUCH lower for women than men. In combat, you can't wait on someone who is too tired or weak to carry the 100 lbs of gear they might be carrying. You can't wait on someone that lacks the upper body strength to climb a rope, or too little endurance to complete a 20 mile hike. Too many times I had to stop what I was doing to help a woman who was too weak or small to lift / carry / reach something.

Women tend to be more emotional. War means making decisions and taking actions that require a level head under the most extreme pressure- breaking down in tears is not an option. I know that sounds like sexist stereotyping, but again I've seen too many women lose their cool or lose their decision making ability under pressure. "Toughness" is mostly mental, and women just aren't as tough as men.

Male / female interaction in combat- Privacy and hygiene are difficult to come by in a combat environment, and women require more of both. The male instinct to protect the female is not easily overcome and can lead to poor decisions or concessions if a woman is in danger. Fraternization would be hard to avoid, and with it comes emotional- not rational- decisions and actions.

And most important of all: My impression (and that of most men in the military that I know) of women in the military is that they just don't "pull their own weight" as well as men. Whether it's physical, emotional or societal issues at play, women tended to be less productive and made poor officers who made poor, emotion-driven, self-serving decisions. It is my opinion that womens role in the US military has been expanded too far- handicapping our military in the name of political correctness is not the best way to serve the country.

Anyone who has served in the military is welcome to disagree. If you haven't, I respectfully ask that you STFU if you take exception with what I've said.

Actually I'd do it for her to feel better. I'd go to hell for her. After all it is still technically murder.

You are just a fucking cunt that never gets a clue.

Remember suicide is against the law and murder after the event is inexcusable. I deal with preventive measures. Your way is the selfish one. If you know the bitch will be raped you let them do it then shoot her what the fuck kind of person does that make YOU?

Fucking witless git. Go fuck a monkey you sand loving cunt.

*cough* REMF *cough*

Yeah the hygene thing is an issue too. Nothing worse than a woman with Aunt Flo visiting when you are trying to hide. The smell alone will give your position away.

How are you even POSSIBLY still married? Seriously, thats some misogynistic shit

Because it is the truth?

You can't get in trouble for speaking the truth generally. If you do, then you point out the fact that it IS the truth and have them try to dispute it.

On a battlefield you don't have the time to clean up like many women do durring that time of the month.

Have you ever had the opportunity to visit a women's public restroom? Until you do, STFU. I mean really, call in a hazmat team durring the summer months.

Also, how do you figure it is a hatred of women? Did you forget what the definition of that word was? I mean really I say shit stinks. Men do it, do I hate them because men shit?

Christ Almighty you are a fucking knee-jerk waiting to happen. Please, go back to your bunker, adjust your tin-foil hat and don't answer the door if anyone knocks.... it may be reality.

Here we go again. Another time when a religidiot like you tries to impose your own belief on someone else. You have no way of knowing that any female is going to be raped. Your assumption that she will get raped regardless of who you are fighting or the exact situation only expresses your racist attitude.

"Would you like to live with the fact that you could have stopped a woman from being raped brutally for however long knowing you COULD HAVE KEPT IT FROM HAPPENING?"

You already stated that you would kill a woman because you could not live with yourself if you knew there was a CHANCE she could be raped but now you are changing your stance because you know that you are wrong. Its due to your lack of education but that is forgivable.

What isn't forgivable is the fact that you think everyone wants to think like you. Just because YOU would want to die if there was a RISK of you being raped, doesn't mean that everyone else would, but that, as I said above, is another example of your stupidity.

"Remember suicide is against the law and murder after the event is inexcusable."

But murder before the event is acceptable and justifiable? You are one stupid priest if you think that. In any case you are going to hell. If you really care so much about the risk of rape, why not kill the rapist rather than the victim.

Stupid dyslexic janitor. Get a god damn education you fool.

And who's calling me REMF? A PFC (private fucking civilian) security guard of the elite Chairborne Rangers?

Can you tell me in all confidence there hasn't been a time that a woman was abused when captured or that even the men were not?

Race has nothing to do with it. We are all HUMAN. Get it through your fucking sand filled head. HUMANS are a RACE. I wouldn't put it past many armies even "white" ones to leave a woman intact.

Religion has nothing to do with it. So you had best keep that strawman out of it.

"You already stated that you would kill a woman because you could not live with yourself if you knew there was a CHANCE she could be raped but now you are changing your stance because you know that you are wrong. Its due to your lack of education but that is forgivable. "

Logic fallacies abound. The adhominem doesn't help your cause much either. Not even worth addressing because you know what I said and I meant what I said. Your trying to twist things won't change the fact that your beliefs are not the right ones where I am concerned.

If I had the chance with my dieing breath to off the chick beign dragged away by the offending army, I would use it to keep her from further harm than you would ever in your priviledged life have to bear. Deal with that fact of reality. My stance has not and will nto change. The wording may have changed for YOU so YOU could understand it with that pea sized stone in your head people would be gracious enough to call a brain.

"What isn't forgivable is the fact that you think everyone wants to think like you. Just because YOU would want to die if there was a RISK of you being raped, doesn't mean that everyone else would, but that, as I said above, is another example of your stupidity."

War. POWs are tortured. Much of the torture is of the sexual nature. Pick up a fucking book you dim-witted moron. Read the stories of some of the POWs who HAVE been recovered. You probably never saw the last instance where our soldiers who were actually lost and ended up surrendering got the fuck beaten out of them and that was displayed on national television for all to see. (I believe this was the last serb croatian shitfest. HP can probably remember what I'm talking about if I got the actual countries wrong)

There is FACTUAL evidence that supports my claims that war attrocities take place. People are not what you hope they are in your deluded world. I only think the worst because THAT IS HOW THINGS ARE. I'm a God damned realist.

"But murder before the event is acceptable and justifiable? You are one stupid priest if you think that. In any case you are going to hell. If you really care so much about the risk of rape, why not kill the rapist rather than the victim."

It is an assisted suicide. If I was taken prisoner I woudl likely try and kill myself as well to avoid the torture or chance of giving up valuable information. No training will ever keep you from talking. It just gets you a bigger ass kicking. Everyone has a breaking point.

As for your idiotic question. Ok kill one of the soldiers carting awaye their ass-pie. What about the other 5 surrounding her? Don't be a schmuck.

The only person showing any lack of intelligence and education is you. If what you have "learned" is an education, you can keep it. I'd rather live in the real world and deal with it that hope that there are actually others living in the same non-existant eutopia that you do.

And I'm the one that is uneducated.... :rolleyes:

You have opinion to guide your feelings ont he matter. I have fact. i'll stick with fact over fiction. Thanks for playing, you are the weakest link. Goodbye.

/It would be interesting if they upped the stakes of that game and shot the person who was the weakest link right there.

During World War II, Russian women on the frontlines frequently killed themselves and other soldiers, because they could not throw their grenades beyond the casualty radius. That is also eflected in modern studies, as well, with many other issues coming into play as well. Women in general simply cannot bear the same loads as a male marine/soldier/whatever, with injuries being far more prevalent, as the article demonstrates. Women's hips are shaped in such a way that weight is distributed disproportionately across the legs and back, making joint and back injuries a recurring problem.
As it stands, there are completely different (lower) physical fitness standards for women in all branches of the armed forces, particularly the air force and navy. While this double standard might suffice for more administrative/logistical-related occupations, a field environment does not allow for this kind of discrimination. Everyone needs to be able to carry his or her own pack.
In my personal opinon, women should have the option of infantry and special forces, but only if they can compete on the same fitness scale as their male counterparts. Personal load-bearing capabilities would also need to be taken into account, because current military physical fitness tests do no account for combat loads at all. Psychological issues should not be an issue one way or the other, because although most women would not want to be part of the frontlines, there are many exceptions. This is speaking from my personal experiences and information reflected through studies carried out through the DOD. I wish I had statistics to quantify this, but I do not.

There's also the other dynamic of tensions between the sexes, compounded by the issue of authority and respect. In an environment composed primarily of men, sexist comments are inevitable, and sensibilities are occasionally offended. This doesn't happen so much in the Marine Corps (skin is a bit tougher), but it is a problem that has no real solution. In the situation of men and women together in the frontlines, this problem is compounded immensely. How severe this would actually become is dependent on a lot of factors, and the fact that such a paradigm in a modern military has not come to exist yet.

I'd much rather be chairbound than a REMF. I mean c'mon. Why bother joining if you aren't going to do anything?

I refuse to be a REMF which is why I'm not currently enlisted. I won't sign my life away like an idiot because some dog-face talked me into it like I was a kid out of gradeschool.

Christ almighty, didn't you even consider your options or do any research before joining... the reserves no less.

Wanting to be on the front line vs. actually handling being on the front line mentally are very different things.

So anyone who doesn't sign up for 11B doesn't do anything at all? Sounds like a movie-inspired macho-illusion to me.

Did you consider the fact that not everyone who doesn't serve in a forward unit is an incompetent puke of a dog-face who joined up to pay for the loan on their car?

Not trying to defend Hollowpoint here at all, but based on what you said, you seem to have some grave misconceptions. Feel free to clarify if I'm wrong.

"I refuse to be a REMF which is why I'm not currently enlisted"

Too bad- you could have learned a technical skill that would have enabled you to get a job that requires skills more challenging than staying awake and telling people where the bathroom is.

Rev's right. Women aren't and haven't ever been built for war. Not to be sexist, but that's the way it is: sexist. Just like I wasn't built to give birth to babies. The world is a sexist place. And men and women were not created equal. No person is equal to any other.

I'm sure some women could handle being tossed into battle just fine, but then again I'm a man I couldn't handle being shot at. The deepest thing is, you can't let one woman in without letting all of them in. And if every woman who wants to be a G.I. Jane gets to be one, that could lead to trouble. Like Rev said ealier, rape is just the begining. There's alot that people would argue that women have the right to be in the military, and even in the front lines. And they do ans should have that right. but it just isn't smart.

You think it is assisted suicide?! What the fuck is wrong with you. Its only suicide if the other person wants to die. Just because you would want to die, does not mean they would want to die. It is not assisted suicide - it is murder and you are an idiot if you think that they would want to die too. Why not ask Jessica Lynch if she would rather be dead than having gone through her capture.

And if all POWs were tortured, you probably think its your duty to kill every potential POW just because YOU think they don't want to live. You are a selfish idiot. Thank yourself that you are too fucked up to ever be in a military position.

If they got what it takes...them let them do it. We all know, no matter what is going on, there comes a time when every woman's life, that a hankerin' to have a cock in there mouth comes along. What better time to have a woman, than in a life or death combat situation, when the need to get some meat stuck between their teeth occurs? God save our fighting men.
It will do a mother proud to know that their son died with a smile on his face.

the chances of a woman even still getting her period is very rare because of the rigorous training during boot camp. It's called "secondary amenorrhea." When a woman's fat stores drop to below 15% of her total body weight, she will often stop menstruating because low body weight and body fat decrease her supply of the necessary chemical building blocks for the hormones involved.

Reg Why are you always on about women, Stan?
Stan I want to be one.
Reg What?
Stan I want to be a woman. From now on, I want you all to call me Loretta.
Reg What?!
Stan It's my right as a man.
Judith But why would you want to be Loretta, Stan?
Stan I want to have babies.
Reg You wanna have babies?!
Stan It's every man's right to have babies if he wants them.
Reg But... you can't have babies!
Stan Don't you oppress me!
Reg I'm not oppressing you, Stan, you haven't got a womb! Where's the foetus gotta gestate? You're gonna keep it in a box?!
Judith Here, I've got an idea. Suppose you agree that he can't actually have babies, not having a womb, which is nobody's fault, not even the Romans', but that he can have the right to have babies.
Francis Good idea Judith! We shall fight the oppressors for your right to have babies, brother. Sister, sorry.

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hmm,not sure why that didn't work... so its best that everyone just ignore that

I wonder what it's supposed to be.....

Canadian Flag

And that is why it didn't work :eyemouth:

Yes I will allow that some women do stop having their periods.

However not all will. Also, once boot camp is over you will regain some of the body fat. My sister was in, did a tour in Korea, she got her body fat back.

Also my wife has been in sport throughout her school career, including college. She was thin... rail thin much of he time. All lean muscle. She still had her periods.

Chicks still get their periods. If they didn't the Commisary/PX wouldn't bother stocking feminine hygene products or allow any to be brought to boot camp.

Like perhaps EMT training being a combat medic Ranger? That was the technical skill I was going fo. No ranger slots were open so I wouldn't sign. I qualified for pretty much anything I wanted but the needs of the Army didn't fit with what I wanted. I would take nothing less. If I am signing my life away I'm going to get a good deal with interest.

My friend was doing satcom work. Nice technical skill. He doesn't do a damn thing with it in life. Your anecdotal remarks about skills that MAY help you in like mean nothing.

Nice ad hominem though. It just proves you know nothing. Nice chatting with you. Have a great day!

I wouldn't say anyone who doesn't sing up for 11b but water purifiers are retarded, as are cooks. I don't like cooking for myself why the fuck would I want to cook for a fucking army? :eyemouth:

I know they all didn't join for that reason. I never said they did. I pointed out that he was just a REMF. It is fact. REAR ESCHELON MOTHER FUCKER. Simple as that.

However the reservists ARE usually incompetent pukes who signed upfor the loans. Enilisted buddies who eventually finished out in the reserves can attest to the reserveists are a bunch of lazy ass bastards.

The only misconceptions are those you chose to read when they weren't there. Everyone has their place, HP's was in theback of the bus. He acts all big and bad but when you point out a simple fact that he was just a REMF he gets pissy. My satcom friend wasn't on the front lines and he doesn't take it personally.

Remember, the folks here are fond of making fun of the current job I hold. But it pays the bills and gives me time to study he things I enjoy from time to time. If they can't take a bit of truth to counter THEIR misconceptions of what my job entails too fucking bad.

Everyone has their place but trying to speak from authority when you have none (addressing his 10 years as a waterboy... or whatever he actually did as a REMF) doesn't account for much.

Besides it is fun to poke the tardling with a stick.

Ah, talking out your ass about a subject you know almost nothing about... again.

You don't typically enlist right away to be a Ranger- only AFTER you've put some time in does one get a slot to go to Ranger school, THEN they wait for a slot in a Ranger unit. Had you served, you'd know that. Once again you're pretending to know something about a subject you're clueless about. Enlist in an infantry unit and you can call me a (former) REMF all you want- I'll take it in stride. Until then, STFU, you lowlife failure.

Not that I think you'd have actually made it through Ranger school...

Bullshit. When you sign up you get the option 40 (Ranger, airborne). That means you get the slot to go to RIP. From there if you make it you go to school after being in batt. for a while or if you really deserve it.

I've actually done the research and spoken with former and current Rangers. Remember this for your next life, option 40. That guarantees a slot in RIP (Ranger Indoctrination Program) If your papers do NOT say option 40 (tends to have a description along with it like, RIP and Airborne) then you are not guaranteed anything.

I'll call you anything I want. You were a REMF. I don't give a fuck what you want or expect you WERE a fucking REMF. May as well have been a security guard. After all you basically did nothing but fetched towels for the folks that did real work. :mfinger2:

What you think matters nothing because you are not knowledgeable in anything it seems.

If you think anything is guaranteed in the military, you're more ignorant than I thought.

The RIP doesn't mean shit- it's just what says: an indoctrination program; kind of like Ranger pre-school- like I said, you have to serve some time before Ranger school, then wait for slot to open... or in your case take on a new job as a cook since you wouldn't have made the cut anyways.

As far as my role, I was too busy training to fetch towels for anybody... unlike yourself: a glorified janitor who's lucky to fetch coffee for people with real jobs.

I suspect there were plenty of slots available, but they knew that without the companionship of your 17 cats you just couldn't hack it.

Any document signed and agreed upon by both parties is a legal and binding contract. Sorry even the military can't fuck you if you go over the document carefully.

Sure they can make life hard but that doesn't mean they can back out of the deal.

You are now backtracking with the "serve some time" speil. Won't work. you were and are still wrong. Deal with it.

I control access to a datacenter for a cell company. I also "escort" people out of the place if theydon't belong there. I don't fetch coffee or anything else. They hire janitors to do janitorial work. Just like they hire REMFs to do shit jobs and work behind the lines.

There were no slots available for 91w with a ranger option (40) I was at meps. Before that the recruited said there were. The real deal mapers are at meps and when it was time to sign he tried to sell me something else. I walked. Sure I could have gone in as airborne and 91w but I wanted that ranger option. That or nothing. I have standards. I'd rather not be a lowlife REMF.

I'm not going to even try to explain the way things actually work in the military, Rev- you haven't served, and until you do trying to explain it would be impossible.

The fact of the matter is that you haven't earned the right to call anyone a REMF, Jarhead or anything else. For someone who's never served to do so makes them look like a pathetic wannabe... oh, wait a minute- I guess that does describe you pretty well, doesn't it?

And don't try to sex up what you do- sitting at a desk, asking for ID's, trying to stay awake and directing people (people with real jobs) where the conference room is rates about a half a step above janitor. Just about ANY position in the military is more rewarding than what you do. Good luck though, maybe you can work your way up to receptionist someday...

Seeing as Hollowpoint probably has much more military experience than anyone else currently on this thread (even though he admits his own experience is limited to reserve service), I will tend to agree with the points he has posted previously rather than lend my hand to theory. Real life experience is more important than any theory someone may think up while trying to be an egalitarian.

As a side note, military service is far from the only acceptable way to serve your country. I personally feel a strong drive to return something for my country but I am physically incapable of serving in the military like women. My left knee is messed up beyond easy repair, and even with surgery I wouldn't be able to withstand the rigors of basic training even if I were to serve in a post I would be best suited for in the military (linguist, JAG, etc.). Not to mention my eye sight which has left me with poor depth perception and colorblindness (odds are I wouldn't be the best shot in the world).

So, instead, I'd like to pursue a position with the US Department of State. Sure I won't be sitting in a fox hole, but whether you're carrying an assault rifle or a laptop you can make a meaningful contribution to your country.

More women who want to serve their country should consider that. What makes the US military so great is not just its troops on the ground, it's the support personnel that keep those troops out there. It's less glorious and flashy, but without it our military would be dumb, blind and starving.

And she's got outrageously small wrists.

blah not even going to start on this one...

in the British Marines all soliders are expected to pass a APWT (annual personal weapons test) and if needs be advance on enemy positions with bayonet fixed.

you exclaim "gives me time to study he things I enjoy from time to time." well why doesn't this apply to the reserves? If they enjoy it what right do you have to humilate them for their choice of pass time?

anyway, reserves are a very valuable assest even if they are only weekend warriors!

As a female who was not only in the army but also married to a soldier I say women don't belong there, We really aren't suited for it. Emotionally or physically, sure there is that rare individual, but it is certainly not the majority. It causes emotional stress for both sexes to be put together in a combat environment. The military already has enough deaths without anymore spouses killing each other. That happens enough. It just doesn't mix.

The same right they feel they have to attempt to humiliate me for my current job.

While it may be enjoyable to be a reservist for some, most real enlisted which I have spoken with, have given very disapproving comments on how they conduct themselves.

I know this is a silly question to you (because you like being assfucked) but consider this...

You know you will be brutally beaten. You know you will be brutally raped. Would you rather be raped and tortured endlessly or kill yourself?

This goes back to the issue of WOMEN being on the front lines. Men have a natural tendency to want to protect them. Protection in this case would be keeping them out of the hands of an enemy. If it was a male... well he knows what is in store for him and he can resist and thus be killed. A women would likely resist, be knocked senseless then ravaged.

You bother because you are a troll. You were caught giving out misinformation and thus tried to backpedal.

Remember as a US citizen I have every right to call you whatever the fuck I want to REMF. Hell you were a reservist REMF. What is the big deal? That is what you were? If you are insulted too bad. You should have changed MOSes if you didn't like what you were doing.

I also work mornings, no problem staying awake. Busy place dealing with vendors and people working in our datacenter daily. Nothing to sex up, it is a job that puts food on the table. You wouldn't know a real job if one was hnded to you on a silver fucking platter. Of course anything that YOU don't do isn't considered worthy so it wouldn't matter if I was doing anything else either. ad hominem. You attack the person rather than the point of an argument. You are a fucking idiot. End of story.

What amazes me is that you people think your jobs are difficult and that only people of YOUR caliber could even possibly do that work. Well you know what? You are wrong. You have no clue as to what the people you consider beneath you know or can do or have done. You are a blind twit. I've watched these vendors working on the servers, running cable, setting up the networks, and it'sa ll stuff I have done before. Sure I'll grant that it wasn't perhaps with the exact same equipment (HP superdomes, storagetek robot libraries etc.) but I've built countless boxes, set up many a network and firewalls, ran too much cable to care to count etc.

Hell you don't even consider people doing triage for operations problems worthy work so why the fuck bother continuing? I'm proud of what I do. I am a responsible person who takes care of his family. I have a high work ethic. I won't berate people for their job but their joblessness I will.

Right now my place is to take care of the little (not little job-wise, because consider all jobs worth something) people like you who put themselves up on pedestals.

One would think that a right-wing conservative would have more respect for the person that works because they are responsible, but you are just looking for something you can attack with because you are shooting blanks. You have nothing left.

I pity you.

Lean and thin doesn't mean small.

She is 5'9" 140 lbs.

Not in his eyes. What matters to his is only what you currently do. Your past accomplishments mean nothing. MY experience is pretty extensive in quite a few areas. Doesn't mean a damn thing to people who just want to attack. So, why should his experience be counted for in anything?

So feel free to theorize as much as you like. Do the research for yourself and come to your own conclusions.

As for the rest, yep, jobs are jobs, each serve their place and role.

Ok how about you answer the question...

My wife said it would all depend on what she lived for and didn't have an answer. It is hard to think about if you haven't gone through the trauma to understand whether it would be bearable beforehand.

If you were in a squad who was all gunned down and you were being carted off to be raped, tortured, etc. would you rather remain a POW and take your chances or end it. This is of course based on the presumtion that you are fightingi n a war with an enemy that has no compunction when it comes to torture and rape. Let us say the "less civilized" of nations.

The answer is easy for me. In that situation I would miss my family and wife dearly, but they would have to rape my COLD DEAD ass. Plus, there are security issues that could be compromised through the torture process. Put a bullet in my head and save them the time and effort.

I agree with you, because I'm a pessimist and I don't want raped.

But you do have to admit, it'd be a hard task to kill a female friend and fellow comrade (can I say that) and it'd probably suck to be shot.

There are lots of what-ifs: what if I wouldn't be raped, what if there are reinforcements coming, what if they don't even have dicks and only want to hug me?

your just creating a childish cirticular argument "oh well they started it", you were the one who started off by insulting HP's choice. Geez

Why should I listen to his experience?

Well... he's been involved with the military for ten years. How long have you been involved in a direct way with the military?

He's seen women in the military and you haven't. The same with the post you're attacking down below.

How do you reccomend I carry out my research? Honestly?

I'm just following what a person with experience says, which incidentally is what most would do.

And yes, jobs are jobs and every body has to have their place. I'm a man, but given my physical condition and other talents my place is definitely not on the front lines. I don't have a problem with that, and if I can serve in another role I will.

Really, do you even read what you post?

You just don't get it. Regardless of whether, in that situation, I wanted to die or not, it is MY decision to pull the trigger or whatever. Not someone elses.

Ok the point flew right over your head (he doesn't respect experience or care what anyone has experienced so you shouldn't either). I'm not going to state it again in tard just so you can understand it. When you grow up you can read it again and maybe then it will sink in.

"Well... he's been involved with the military for ten years. How long have you been involved in a direct way with the military?"

How direct? Do I have to have been enlisted, a reservist, have family in the military or friends? I have both friends family and co-workers who were and are serving.

"How do you reccomend I carry out my research? Honestly?"

Honestly... you could read psycology books pertaining to to military. History books. News media from both sides of the fence. Talk with more than one person who makes an appeal to authority that he has been serving for 10 years as a REMF. You can learn a lot by reading. You can learn a lot by talking with people who actually care to carry out a conersation and aren't just trying to troll, or play the one-up game.

I'm following what others with experience say. I'm not saying your point is invalid mind you. I'm just stating that I have had more experience than just the words of some anonymous person on some website who claims they have 10 years in as a REMF reservist and has the audacity to bash what I currently do for work. I have enough experience to understand that I disagree with his "sexying up" his own damn job while being a hypocritical prick. I have enough experience from more than one source to know what goes on in the military. For Christ's sake my Uncle is in Delta, my sister a a communications specialist (wouldn't been airborne but shin splints fucked her up with jumping) Bud Dave was a REMF in Satcom (Enlisted 11b then went satcom reservist), while my other friend Mark was in an anti-terrorist unit in the Marines.

Really, do you read what I post?

You seemed to have taken my post as an attack against you when it was not. I was simply stating that you have every right to theorize however you see fit. Whether it is right or wrong is another matter but that is what research if for.

There's no reason to kiss the prick's ass or slob on his knob. He isn't anything more than just some anonymous dickhead who thinks his word is law.

I won't give out any more information regarding my friends or family because of opsec and persec reasons. Someone who supposedly was in the military for 10 years should be able to respect that yet for some odd reason they use it to say it is an excuse to not provide the facts. (This was donei n another thread about where the seized drugs go.)

Then again, seeing as how he was a reservist REMF he probably didn't need to worry about opsec or persec.

I respect the fact that you understand your capabilities and where your talents would best serve.

That's nice but are you a woman?

As for being a pessimist, there is no reason to be. Mistreatment of POWs has been documented quite a bit. The mistreatment is grounded in fact not fiction.

Well, no, I'm a male, I was trying to place myself in a woman's position.

And yeah, I was just saying pessimists automatically assume that they don't have a fighting chance.

For some it may be easier... take Hoochie and HP, but for most men it is impossible to place ourselves int heir shoes. I only know what I would rather not have to endure and I'm a pretty hard hearted individual and not in the least bit squirmy when it comes to torture. Rape... shoot me.

This is why I'm asking for women to answer the question. After all their thoughts on the matter of rape may be quite different than what most people think.

Point well taken.

BWHAHAHA.... The Rev... /snicker/...calling me...hahaha...a troll... HAHAHAHAHAHAHA....

AND THEN...hahaha... this is good... /snicker/... Rev- a pathetic wannabe / security guard / dropout- calls others...hahahahaha.... "little people"....bwHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. aaaaaaAAAHAHAHAHA it's like Rosie O'Donnell calling someone a "fat dyke" HAHAHAHA....laughing....hahaha....too.... hard....hahaha....can't.... breathe...HAHAHAHA....losing conciousne...

Well call the Pentagon, we have ourselves a potential 5-star General here- after all, he's talked to some military people, watched the news and maybe read a Clancy novel... he must be a flat out military EXPERT. Call CNN, the could use a military advisor.

What was that I said about being making yourself look like a pathetic wannabe?

What matters to his is only what you currently do Not true- education counts, too. Oh, wait a minute- you failed there too. Never mind.

The same thing you are doing by making yourself out to be something more than you are/were. C'mon REMFboy truth really hurt that bad?

I never once stated that I was an expert but I have heard quite the opposite of what you profess to be true from other sources. Majority rules in this matter. Your opinon to ME means squat.

Other may think something of it but I advise they get more education than just that of one person who claims 10 years experience as a reservist REMF. After all, you claim I'm no expert from listening to contrary statements from your rhetoric, so why should they (the foobs) take what you say as anything other than just smoke being blown out your ass? I mean c'mon why is your testimony suposedly superior to other's who have actualy served and served on the front, are continuing to serve, both enlisted and reservist alike?

Asshat you are, asshat you remain.

well this sure as hell has deviated from the actual topic and come down to rj and hp exchanging childish insults... but hey whats new

Did not... besides he started it. Poopyhead :)

*slaps hollowpoint on the wrist*

That's not the point but yes I know he did, personally I believe that any one doing any sort of military service commends far more respect than someone who simply refuses on the grounds of not being refused to join something that they wouldn't have a chance in anyway.

now if you two carry on their will be no milk & cookies!

Perhaps if you started gaining the respect from foobies that you expect others to gain from you, you would not be the bastard foobie of Kungfoo.

Also, reading off the internet does not make you an expert on the subject. If you think you are impressing whoever reads your posts, you aren't, and you only make a fool out of yourself.

Basically if you weren't such a cunt, people would start liking you. :)

That question is impossible to answer, but I think if you look into the past. I n medievil time, women would cut their daughters throats and then jump from the towers to keep from being taken prisoner and raped when an enemy captured their castle. I think that may be an answer in itself.

Respest begets respect. When he deserves it he'll get it.

As fo rnot havign a chance you are in no place to judge what I could or coudln't do. Only the chance to do it would prove one way or another.

I'm a very stubborn person. I'll fight to the last when I'm right. I'll fight to the last to do me best. If there is something I want I will get it. If I don't get the opportunity, I o course have no control over it. I can't stand authority. That alone would make me defiant enough to NOT quit because that is what they try to get you to do.

I conduct myself in daily life with a proper attitude and determination. I have a very strong work ethic and I want to get the job done right.

Your beliefs of course matter not one whit to me because of your bias.

Have a nice day.

Thank you for making my point even more eloquently than I could have ever imagined.

Like you also said, truth hurts. I know this is only a coping mechanism for you and I forgive you for that. You'll grow up and learn eventually. I'm not going to hold my breath though because we all kow that will be a long time from now.

Well cum-guzzler,
I expect nothing from anyone. You don't deserve respect and neither does HP and a few others. You nor they have earned it.

I don't waste my time trying to earn respect from those who don't deserve any themselves.

In order for me to be a bastard foobie of foo I would have to not have had a father. I had one. I'm not an illegitimate child like you are.

I'm sorry you have never heard of the places called libraries out there on your sand dune but there are many places to learn. I've been to School, I've had personal encounters with people, and in general I've lived life.

The only people who don't like me are those who start shit and know I don't back down. I'm not one for being bullied. IIt will n ever happen. If I disagree with something you say, I'll damn well let you know. If you can't handle opinions that are different than yours, best keep them to yourself or take it off a public message board system.

I may be an asshole but I'm not a cunt. You are the one who whines and weeps over your spankings. Take some time, pick the sand ut of your gash and get on with life. You aren't impressing anyone... well except maybe the other twits who are all on the bandwagon because they know I'll keep putting them in their places as well.

But they matter not.

Poor baby. Making up for the childhood where you were bullied and molested by your parents? Good for you!! :)

I'll bet that your wife is mute and dumb if that is your attitude towards people. Hahah basically just a live sex doll.

Well you can keep "putting people in their place" and showing us how amazingly stupid you are.

P.S. Its ok if your dad beat the fuck our of your mom and beat her silly slut face. It happens all the time. You are not alone - but don't repeat that with your wife. :mfinger2:

I'm 5'8 150 lbs and not in the least bit at and during basic training I got extra periods, yick! Everyone is different, way different. Their is nothing to say you will or won't have one, it's a fact of life.

Making up for my childhood? How do you figure? Because I correct your baseless assumption that I'm a bastard? Remember, just because you may be illegitimate doesn't mean everyone else is.

MY attitude is respect deserves respect. We respect eachother. This is something you will never know anything about. I pity you for that.

Considering your level of intelligence you are a far cry from someone who could possibly guage properly what stupid is.

My father never beat me. My mother divorced him when I was 6 months old. You seem to feel the need to project your own issues upon others. Seek help from a licensed clinical psychologist or psychiatrist and deal withy our inner demons.

You poor pitiful soul. I almost (not really) feel bad putting my foot to your ass repeatedly. You deserve to live in the sand with no rights and just a lone camel you keep you company and to give you that "special time" you so desperately crave since your father doesn't want you anymore (or so I hear.)

May as well give up because you'll never reach up to my level. I'll just keep you down on your knees where you belong and keep shoving my cock down your throat.

Oh and if there are women who's fat stores drop less than 20% I'd like to see them. The army feeds you pretty good. Some girls got bigger.

After seeing what she gave birth to, its no wonder she divorced your dad.

You Bastard child you! :love:

You must not understand the words you use. I wasn't born out of wedlock. MY father didn't rape my mother like yours did.

She divorced him because of the physical abuse. She wanted to protect her children.

If you can't understand something as simple as that, you just remove all credibility or any of your arguments where you make appeals to emotion. Your whining about the poor people who deserve better treatment of this or that, yada fucking yada. You probably were beaten as a child.

I feel very sorry for you but that wouldn't stop me from beating the fuck out of you either just on general principal.

Do you realise that YOU are the cause of your parents divorce? I mean 6 months after you are born and they divorce? You must have been one difficult baby. Don't blame it on physical abuse, even the doctor probably slapped your mom when you were born.

Yeah, coping with being educated, having a good job, owning a home instead of living in a crappy apartment, growing up with non-abusive parents, being able to afford top shelf booze, cigars and travelling... yeah- that's SO difficult to cope with.

How do YOU manage to cope, Rev?

Funny the abuse went on for 6 years before I was born. My sister can attest to that.

Hope you never make it state-side. I'd be inclined to bury you.

No offense meant to either of you, but man.... You guys are brutal, I want to see a real-time fight..

Not to mention you're straying so far off topic I have a headache.

I cope by putting lying cunts like yourself in their place.

You are so full of shit it is unbelievable.

At least I have a great woman to go home to every night who loves me that I don't have to pay for sex and isn't my mother.

If you weren't trying so hard to convince people you are something you aren't, people would be more inclined to believe your lies. For example you are uneducated in many areas of life, your job is no better than that of a garbage man, or a burger flipper, or a walmart employee, or anyone else. You don't own a home the bank does. You are deceiving yourself into thinking you own it. It isn't until the last payment on the mortgage is paid. I can't say whether or not they were abusive in a physical aspect, but they abused you mentally enough that retardation set in. Top shelf booze at safeway is schmidts and Busch. I'm not impressed really. Cigars are retarded. They reek and only people with oral fixations for having a long fat smooth shaft in their mouth's bmoke them.

I cope by thanking my mother she got herself out of the abusive relationship and worked to take care of her two children instead of living off welfare.

I cope by actually learning and understanding what I'm taught.

I cope by having just as good a job as everyone else out there.

I cope by living in an apartment until I'm ready to move out of the NW (can't stand the rain and cold)

I cope by knowing I was never abused physically, mentally, or emotionally and thanking God for it.

I cope by not buying the 160 dolar bottle of Tequilla and taking my wife out to dinner, dancing, and getting her into her newly bought lingerie(then out of it.)

I cope by Taking vacations with my wife. We went to Cozumel for diving in June, and we are going to California next week. Next summer it may be backpacking in Europe but we can't decide on where we want to go yet.

I cope by living life. I don't have to lie to cope with problems. I'm sorry you do. I would keep you in my prayers but alas, you are hopeless.

Any other questions REMFy?

Can you honestly handle any more truth? Will it ever sink in through you head that you impress no-one that matters? Will you even get over the fact that you have been put in your place time and again by an "uneducated" "glorified janitor"?

You are simply pathetic.
Happy Holidays.

Well, let's look at research in general.

Hollowpoint is what we like to call a "Primary Source". This means he is someone who is involved directly in the action, and is not providing indirect information (like a secondary or tertiary source would). Generally, when doing any research, the more primary sources a person can get the better.

The fact that you have friends and family members in the military makes you a secondary source, therefore less likely to be reliable than a primary source who has first hand experience.

For example: If you had a question about Argentina, it would be much wiser to come to me and ask me about it than it would be to go to Burn2Shine (personal friend of mine) and ask him about it. The same applies to Mormons. If you want to learn more about them, you should probably talk to one (me) than speak to someone else who has simply "studied about them", because I can almost promise you that those who have "studied about them" will be dead wrong nine times out of ten.

As far as research goes, I would like to cite one of the greatest military writers of all time, Sun Tzu, who had this to say:

We are not fit to lead an army on the march unless we are familiar with the face of the country--its mountains and forests, its pitfalls and precipices, its marshes and swamps. We shall be unable to turn natural advantages to account unless we make use of local guides.

So... it's better to talk to a "local guide" (someone who knows the terrain) than, say, a guy with a good map. I'm sure the map is full of good information and comes from a decent gudie, but it's still a secondary source and inferior to the local guide's vastly superior knowledge.

And yes, I am aware of the irony of citing Sun Tzu, who wrote all of this before ever being in the military. Then again, he did lead an army later and managed to win a great many battles, so I'd say he had the chance to prove what he wrote.

And hollowpoint can honestly say he has, as has the female member of the armed services below. They are both primary sources, as they have spent a significant amount of time in the military whereas you have served none. They KNOW what they are talking about because they have experienced it.

I consider your actions to be basically the same as if you were teaching me a lesson about the subway systems of Buenos Aires, the tenses of Spanish or French, or even the beliefs of Mormons. While you might have something interesting to say, I will be very likely to fall back on my own first hand experience rather than listen to someone who has only theory.

So, to sum things up, I was being perfectly logical by deferring to Hollowpoint and others with real life military experience. They know, and I am humble enough to admit that I don't, so I will defer to their knowledge.

I believe it was Socrates who said, "I know nothing except the fact of my ignorance."

Now then, I can only assume you will attack this post witht he usual string of childish explitives and largely ineffective but none the less amusing banter.

Hey, that's just been my experience.

Found a more fitting quote from Socrates and I couldn't resist:

Well I am certainly wiser than this man. It is only too likely that neither of us has any knowledge to boast of; but he thinks that he knows something which he does not know, whereas I am quite conscious of my ignorance. At any rate it seems that I am wiser than he is to this small extent, that I do not think that I know what I do not know.

Come get me fat boy!

PS. Then slap your sister - its her fault! :mfinger2:

Even without the rape happening we would still like to shoot you. :)

Fat? How the fuck did you figure that one? Oh, fat by your thrid world country standards? Because I'm not stick thin with a distended belly I'm "fat." I get it now.

Just make it state-side.

"Hollowpoint is what we like to call a "Primary Source". This means he is someone who is involved directly in the action, and is not providing indirect information (like a secondary or tertiary source would). Generally, when doing any research, the more primary sources a person can get the better. "

Served in the past. He is not active military personel. Also, I have sited a few "Primary sources" of my own. Generally when one person is being contradicted by the thoughts, opinions, or facts of many others their information that they are providing should be looked into further.

"The fact that you have friends and family members in the military makes you a secondary source, therefore less likely to be reliable than a primary source who has first hand experience."

Wrong. My sources were actually involved in conflicts. They were enlisted regulars first and a few went reserve after. HP was a REMF reservist. His "experience" doesn't mean squat as he was never in combat.

"For example: If you had a question about Argentina, it would be much wiser to come to me and ask me about it than it would be to go to Burn2Shine (personal friend of mine) and ask him about it. The same applies to Mormons. If you want to learn more about them, you should probably talk to one (me) than speak to someone else who has simply "studied about them", because I can almost promise you that those who have "studied about them" will be dead wrong nine times out of ten. "

Then by your reasoning someone who has a PhD is theology doesn't know anything about religions compared to people who are actively participating in a religion. Yep, real good logic there buddy.

As for things like personal experience (you stated we should go to you vs. Burn) gee, doesn't that die in with my asking MY friends and family about THEIR PERSONAL EXPERIENCE in those areas? Funny how you contradict yourself.


"So... it's better to talk to a "local guide" (someone who knows the terrain) than, say, a guy with a good map. I'm sure the map is full of good information and comes from a decent gudie, but it's still a secondary source and inferior to the local guide's vastly superior knowledge. "

You're right which is why I'll cite all of my friends experience rather than follow blindly that of a REMF who claims to have served as a reservist for 10 years.

Would it make any difference if my sources were to be the local guides here? Nope, the same folks would just argue because they can't handle being wrong. Frankly, they don't want to waste their time here. I can't blame them at times, they are too busy working to put a shitfuck REMF who is full of himself inhis place.

"And hollowpoint can honestly say he has" Has WHAT? He hasn't done a fucking thing. He wasn't involved in anydirect conflict whatsoever. He was a silly reservist REMF. My sister was over in IRaq for Desert Storm, My Marine friend was there and watched his SGT get blown away in Desert Storm, My friend Dave was likely hiding in a hole somewhere... heh sorry dave :eyemouth: My uncle was doing shit I can't say anything about because he can't say anything about it. These folks were/are all full term enlisted people. These are "guides" with more experience than some asshat who was sitting in the back sipping a fucking latte or playing at being a weekend warrior.

This bit of research is from first hand accounts of people who were there. This isn't even getting into the part regarding real research involving studying books, media, etc.

"So, to sum things up, I was being perfectly logical by deferring to Hollowpoint and others with real life military experience. They know, and I am humble enough to admit that I don't, so I will defer to their knowledge."

I disagree.

Now then since you want to be attacked instead of carrying on a proper conversation I will oblige you. Your passive aggressive means of drawing me out to attack you was rather pathetic. I mean c'mon, if you are going to challenge someone do it you fucking spineless gimp. I was willing to continue to be civil to you up until your little jab.

Glad you decided to throw that in there. I would have been sorely disappointed if a Foobie could actually carryon a conversation without making a baseless attack. Yes baseless. Respect begets respect. Don't fuck with me and you can expect I won't fuck with you. I may disagree but I won't fuck with you.

You can stop sucking HP's dick now I'm sure his daddy would like it back and your father is missing your talents.

Indeed it is fitting. It fits perfectly your ignorance and arrogance.

I know what I do and do not know.

Your father wasted the load your mother should have swallowed. She could have used the nutrients in better ways.

I am going to have to agree with Hooch.
I would much rather be raped and have an opportunity to escape or be rescued. Just like I would rather have my eyes blinded, my fingers cut off one by one than be dead.
Rape, although not the most pleasant of experiences, is not the worst thing that could happen.
Being dead, yeah, I think that is worse.
Women endure rape every day, and not everyone has to go on Oprah and cry about it.
The smart ones just call the police, have the rapist's balls put in a sling, brush it off, and get on with life. It's part of being a woman, and also one of the things that makes us very strong.
I am not surprised by your reaction Rev, in fact I fully understand. It is actually an honorable response.
I would just hope that if it happened to me that they would drug me to make me submissive. I think it would make it much easier to forget about.

" I get it now. "

You always were a bit slow. Must be from watching your mom getting punched in her fat cunt.

" It's part of being a woman, and also one of the things that makes us very strong."

Rape is part of being a woman?

I see. Do you have rape fantasies bychance?

Not to be insulting but I think that is fucked in the head.

Awww did the petty bitter little man get bruised by having my footput to his ass? Awww, I'm sowwy.

You poor baby.

No I do not have rape fantasies.
As a woman the possibility of being raped is always there.
It is something that you deal with as a woman.
Ever been the only guy with a group of women?
Do you have to think about the fact that they could rape you? No... We do.
You can't possibly understand because you are a man, no offense ;) Women are strong in that respect because I don't know many men who could handle being raped.
In fact I knew someone who couldn't.
Just understand this. Raped is better than dead.
And if you shot me....I would definitely haunt you ;)

Again, "Hey, I know people, so I should know more than people who have been in the military".

You have no actual experience, yet you disagree with those who do. Why? You've had a few passing conversations with people.

Woopty-do, so have I, and the ones I have talked to served in Desert Storm (A-10 Pilot, not a ground pounder I realize) and in the more recent conflict in Iraq.

As far as civility goes, you could certainly work on that. Honestly, for a man that claims to be a minister of some sort, and has the audacity to end each of his posts that seem to contain little more than a string of foul language "in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost, Amen" should really examine himself. Do you really mean to refer to me as a "****ing spineless gimp" and then claim to do so in the name of God?

Wow, I speak two latin-based languages, so oddly enough I can read that... funny how that works... just knowing a little Latin (or more than likely knowing how to copy and paste) isn't terribly impressive.

As a side note, I've never found the little bit of French you posted to be impressive. Time to brush up on your grammar.

As far as a person with a PhD in Theology giving a person a greater respect or knowledge of religion, I remember hearing the Dean of Harvard's School of Divinity discuss this and say he recommended against it as he has found it generally leads to bearing false witness (I'll dig up the link if you'd like). So, his reccomendation, as the Dean of the Harvard School of Divinity, was to actually TALK to a person who is a participant in a religion for the most up to date information available. That only makes sense.

And I personally have read more far fetched and random ideas about my own religion by very self-interested PhDs in Theology and what not that I can't say I trust them. I've heard that I consumate my marriage in the temples (uh, no), that I've been brain washed, that I actually worship Joseph Smith, or even that I am willing to take part in human sacrifice from PhDs. Excuse me if I doubt what they have to say, as my own experience has proved them wrong.

As far as respect begeting respect, I have been respectful. You have decided not to be. Your choice, not mine, although I will inform you that your actions and words make you appear more and more childish with each post.

Speaking of respect, you seem to have remarkabley little for the men and women who do sacrifice to serve our country whereas you make none yourself. Go ahead and refer to them as "weekend wariors" or REMFs all you'd like, but until you PERSONALLY have made some sort of contribution to your country other than paying taxes on alcoholic beverages, then please be my guest to attack Hollowpoint for the ten years he gave to his country doing jobs which you yourself admitted were important.

Your personal vendetta against Hollowpoint is at least fun to watch. You drift further and further from logic as you try to make your points, and then like to point at the rest of us and call us idiots or, frequently, worse.

It should be noted that a female member of the armed forces posted her opinion below, and you chose to argue with that in the most random way I have ever seen.

Really, this just began with the question "should women serve in the front lines or not" and you turned it into a long drawn out "rape theory" thread.

I can hardly wait to read your resopnse to this one.

OK, I get it- you cope by telling yourself that those who actually succeeded in life are just lying about it... whatever makes you feel better about yourself, Rev.

Problem for you is that there are two people on this site that know me personally, so lying about myself wouldn't work very well- there'd always be at least two people who would know I'm lying... which of course I'm not.

Thanks for being honest about having an unskilled, lowlife job, being too poor to afford a house and having to leach off your wife's income to get by, being a mommas boy who didn't have a daddy to show him how to be a man, being uneducated and an overall failure who can't follow through with anything- whether joining the military or getting an education. Now go be honest with a therapist... oops- sorry- forgot that you can't afford one.

As far as you putting me (or anyone else, for that matter) "in their place", I'll let the reader decide.

Don't worry Rev- at least your cats accept you- failure and all.

Personal attacks are much better than actual arguements. They can sometimes be hurtful and have zero actual basis. I only hope that instead of being a retarded person I can graduate to mean person.

Keep telling yourself that. Maybe it will be true if you believe in it enough.

The assholes that know you are lying are your "friends" so of course they won't spill the beans. Either they are paid for or simply love the entertainment of you getting put in your place... repatedly.

Happy holidays fucktard.

Ok I don't have time to keep going through this so I'll try ONCE MORE.

"You have no actual experience, yet you disagree with those who do. Why? You've had a few passing conversations with people."

Because of the extensive experience fo those I know who are in the military. As you are conceding to HP, I concede to the others that I know. Christ on a fucking pogo-stick how hard is that for you to understand?

I have more than passing conversations with my family and friends. The conversations that pass for "passing" are those on this fucking board. Get it?

"As far as civility goes, you could certainly work on that. Honestly, for a man that claims to be a minister of some sort, and has the audacity to end each of his posts that seem to contain little more than a string of foul language "in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost, Amen" should really examine himself. Do you really mean to refer to me as a "****ing spineless gimp" and then claim to do so in the name of God?

You see the thing is. I never said I was perfect. Quite the contrary. I'm civil until a fucking cum-slut like you decides to start poking the stick into the cage.

As for your question. Yes I do intend to call you a fucking spineless gimp. Period. I do so as myself. I'm not speaking for God and I never will. When He has something to say He will.

FACT: I am ordained. This dos not mean I minister to people.
FACT: I'm NOT Christ.
FACT: Never said I was perfect.
FACT: Remember that stone throwing lesson? Read about it. You cast the first stone by making the passive-aggressive attack forcing my hand. Deal with it bitch.

"Wow, I speak two latin-based languages, so oddly enough I can read that... funny how that works... just knowing a little Latin (or more than likely knowing how to copy and paste) isn't terribly impressive."

You deserve to be impressed? How egotistical. I wonder what God things of your prideful nature. Throwing an insult in there as well makes you a hypocrite. Well done.

As a side note, I'll brush up on French when I need to use the language. Try Gaelic then come and bitch about someone's grammar in a foreign language.

"As far as a person with a PhD in Theology giving a person a greater respect or knowledge of religion, I remember hearing the Dean of Harvard's School of Divinity discuss this and say he recommended against it as he has found it generally leads to bearing false witness (I'll dig up the link if you'd like). So, his reccomendation, as the Dean of the Harvard School of Divinity, was to actually TALK to a person who is a participant in a religion for the most up to date information available. That only makes sense. "

So by your logic people who study know nothing. You citing a Dean lends itself to appeal to authority. He would recommend what then? Not attending the school and learning about religion? Interesting. You make no sense whatsoever. Along these lines, talking to someone who is currently a participant just means that HP is very much out of the loop. He isn't active so his say means nothing either. You can't have it both ways. For the most up to date info I'd speak to a couple of my enlisted buddies.

"Speaking of respect, you seem to have remarkabley little for the men and women who do sacrifice to serve our country whereas you make none yourself. Go ahead and refer to them as "weekend wariors" or REMFs all you'd like, but until you PERSONALLY have made some sort of contribution to your country other than paying taxes on alcoholic beverages, then please be my guest to attack Hollowpoint for the ten years he gave to his country doing jobs which you yourself admitted were important."

WRONG. I respect the people who are actually out there busting their humps for our country. You assume way too much. He was a fucking REMF. I made the attempt, I couldn't get 91w with the option 40 I wanted so I didn't want to waste my time or the militaries doing something I wasn't suited for. That is MY contribution. Calling him a REMF is not an attack. This is just an assertion of what his position in the military was. Take his "knowledge" with a grain of salt., cum grano salis.

So what the fuck is your argument consisting of so far? Nothing. Absofuckinglutely nothing. Calling someone who was a weekend warrior a weekwnd warrior is an insult? Odd, I thought that was just calling a spade a spade. Should I call my cat a dog? Should I call Mormons satanic? (quite possible true) Fucking A, grow a fucking brain.

"Your personal vendetta against Hollowpoint is at least fun to watch. You drift further and further from logic as you try to make your points, and then like to point at the rest of us and call us idiots or, frequently, worse."

I don't have a vendetta against him. I just like to point out important facts that should be taken into consideration when they are missing or when they are wrong. You'll note that on some issues I actually agree with him on them. It ends up being semantics. He makes more of the attacks of a personal nature. Remember that before you go defending that fucking cunt. Stop sucking his dick, you don't get any points for it.

I always stay on track unless the person who chooses to argue tries to deflect or twists the argument into a different direction. This is the nature of people using logic fallacies. Trolls do this quite often in order to keep an argument they lost going. Mind you I'm not calling you a troll but you aren't getting anything of what I have been saying so I'm highly suspect of your intelligence because you can't get the simple facts straight.

"It should be noted that a female member of the armed forces posted her opinion below, and you chose to argue with that in the most random way I have ever seen. "

I argued with her? How the fuck do you figure that?
Daydreamtime:"As a female who was not only in the army but also married to a soldier I say women don't belong there, We really aren't suited for it. Emotionally or physically, sure there is that rare individual, but it is certainly not the majority. It causes emotional stress for both sexes to be put together in a combat environment. The military already has enough deaths without anymore spouses killing each other. That happens enough. It just doesn't mix."

So I asked her to answer the question to which she replied: "That question is impossible to answer, but I think if you look into the past. In medievil time, women would cut their daughters throats and then jump from the towers to keep from being taken prisoner and raped when an enemy captured their castle. I think that may be an answer in itself."

I didn't argue with her. I would highly suggest you reread everything before trying to argue. The only person who responded to that question that I "argued" with was Walrus. Magic isn't a woman. Magic is 17. Christ, Magic didn't serve. Can it be stated any simpler for you?

"Really, this just began with the question "should women serve in the front lines or not" and you turned it into a long drawn out "rape theory" thread. "

Yes it did. We have reasons why. My reason for saying theys hould not is that of Rape, torture, and causing casualties as men try to protect them. Also, when they are PMSing they are cruel and would violate the geneva convention.

"I can hardly wait to read your resopnse to this one."

Hope you liked it fucker.

Wow... and I didn't even have to hand you the shovel to dig yourself in further.

Good work. I think you've said all that needed to be said and proved my points far better than I could have.

You want to know what I find funny? The fact that he makes very valid points which you refuse to acknowlege and turn around and attack him instead of trying to refute those points.

I guess that is what happens when people get backed into a corner.

The Rev. does need to cut back on that vulgarity. It doesn't do much good for his arguments because people will attack that to defend their positions. Drop the vulgarity Rev. and you'll probably actually shut a few people up.

That's my :twocents:

Vulgarity? You wouldn't know vulgarity if yourmother queefed while you were eating her outon her period you fucking little AC.

Sign up and get an ID so I can put you on my shitlist, fucker.

At any rate to address your points, it wouldn't matter if I removed the vulgarity or not. People will always try and twist and draw arguments into different directions when they are losing them. It happens all the time. So I may as well vent while I'm ranting and slapping people around :eyemouth:

Merry Christmas.

That was just really potent. Seriously. I know I'm not a part of this argument. But I like reading what you say, and more often than not I agree with it.

And yeah, I'm a 17 year old white middle class male. And the point you made was right. WTF do I have to say about the military or war or women? Not a whole lot.

But I only have one question.. If you are ordained, which I believe you are, than at least at one point, I should hope now, you have served Jesus. Why now do you say you don't minister to people? I mean... bringing glory to God is the point, ministering is a good way to do it. Why wouldn't you?

I have served Christ. I try every day to serve him. However, the reason I don't minister to people is because I don't feel I am fully prepared at this point to do so.

I'm involved in the church right now learning more about ministries and leadership development. When and if I am ready I may take that step to begin ministering. Like I have said before I won't argue, debate, etc. unless I'm fully prepared or knowledgeable. I have more learning and growing to do before I can begin ministering. Too many questions that go against the mainstream faith that I need to have resolved before I will feel confident enough that I can go out there and give His message as it needs to be given.

The word is infalliable am not. Until I get it down pat I won't argue with the people who disbelieve or want to argue about Christianity because I would probably do Christ a disservice. I want to be able to just start pulling quotes, verses etc. out when I need to and not have to look up the stuff to refute them.

So, that's my reason for not doing it at this point in my life. I'll be more than happy to minister to people who do believe or rather debate and study issues within the Bible if they want to. I love the questions, answers, and chellenges presented by other's views.

Merry Christmas,
RJ

That's all well and good, but you're never going to have it "down pat"... You could spend you're entire life studying God's Word, and then redo it, and then do it again and you'd never get it down pat. No one will. Not everyone ministers the same way, some people pray more and some people teach more and some people pastor churches and some people are called to go to college and put up with annoying roommates and suitemates for the glory of God.

Also, there's no need to refute people or argue God with them. It was once said, "God needs servants, not defense attorneys." God is God, therefore he is correct. Jesus said he was the truth, therefore he is the measure by which all truth is measured. You'll never pursuade or argue anyone to Christ it's pointless to try, it's a waste of breath and effort. Allowing the Holy Spirit to convict people's hearts is all the work to be done.

Furthermore, you'll recall the big 12... Name one who was well versed in the Bible or anything but fish and money. No one, they were common taxers and fishers. Why would God call people who weren't prepared to minister to be the leaders of all ministries at the time?

Don't allow yourself to not trust God or have faith that he will be the one doing all the ministering and don't wait to be ready, or else the Body of Christ will lose a great minister.

Love from God and peace too.
MW

I'll minister as the spirit calls me to. I don't follow the real structured formats of some churches and it bothers me whent he churches have an agenda rather than letting the spirit control things.

"Also, there's no need to refute people or argue God with them."

Perhaps but I feel like I have the right to defend my reasons for Loving god and choosing him as my savior. It tends to be the opposing side who makes it an argument because they can't just let people believe what they want to believe. They can't leave it at, I have my opinion.belief, and you have yours. They would rather insult argue and try and convince you that you are wrong. When doing so they set up a great many strawmen. I feel it is only fair to burn the strawmen by pointing out the facts.

"Allowing the Holy Spirit to convict people's hearts is all the work to be done. "

You are forgetting that if people aren't at least being told the truth you are failing to witness to them. By doing so you are condemning them to hell. His word does need to be presented in a non-falicious way. As Christians it is our duty to make people aware of His word even if we do nto convince them. That way thy cannot claim ignorance :eyemouth:

The big 12 were being taught. They were ebing prepared to go out and disciple. They weren't just tossed out there without ANY training whatsoever. Learning is a constant thing. They were well versed in hebrew law and the way of the word. I wish to be so. When my time comes God will let me know.

I trust God fully. He wants me to be prepared and he wants me to succeed. I'm taking the steps to be what He wants. I'm taking the steps in His plan. I fuck up a lot but I'm still trying.

God is patient, for that I am thankful.

God Bless and have a safe and happy Christmas.

You make several good points, all of which can be looked upon as the biggest and most important, but I still submit for you:

Facts are usless as the people we give them to will deny them, we are told that those who do not have the Spirit of God think that the bible is foolishness, and if we're arguing with something it must be of GOD and not of US. Our points are usless, only God's points matter.

Also, I do believe that it is our task to tell those who do not believe about the Gospel. But, what do you need to know to do that? Not much really.. the Gospel is a very short doctrinal belief that is important but not difficult to understand or teach. If you can't seem to back what you say up, or you face an argument you can't seem to win.. Then you can't. Admit that there are people who will reject Christ and move on to the next one.

But I commend you, if you do trust that God will let you know when he is ready for you then you must hear is voice, I commend you for that. But do not claim that you aren't yet ready for the rest of your life and listen to when God thinks you are ready, and listen to his voice in the tasks around you to see how you can minister to people around you.

Best wishes and prayers.

God Bless

You don't like authority unless you have it, right?

Yes I've noticed a few of the traits you speak of...when all grouped together I think it's called arrogance.

'I'll fight to the last when I'm right.'

....And you'll never admit when your wrong.

I'm sorry, it's not my place to point out another persons imperfections, but you seem to be mistaken; you do not own this place.

You speak factually and yet provide little or no facts. It's just sad. You show no compassion and only support a view or action if it benefits you or your country...I just don't understand your way of thinking Rev., it's almost completely self-centred.

Hey welcome to kungfoo, be nice to the trolls, they create content :D

thanks you bastards you've totally messed the paragraphing up grrr

yep:yay:

please watch ur language.
anythin a woman can do a man can do, if not better